How to Snack Smarter on the Go
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About the Show
On this episode, Chuck Gaidica is joined by Shanthi Appelö, registered dietitian for Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan. Together, they discuss ways we can snack smarter on the go.
In this episode of A Healthier Michigan Podcast, we explore:
- What to consider when choosing snacks
- Common mistakes when snacking and how to avoid them
- Tips for navigating portion sizes
- Effective strategies for navigating smarter snacking habits
Transcript
Chuck Gaidica:
Are you constantly on the go? When it comes to snacking, are you choosing convenience over healthier options? This is A Healthier Michigan Podcast, episode 155. And coming up, we discuss ways we can approach snacking in a smarter way while on the go.
Are you constantly on the go? When it comes to snacking, are you choosing convenience over healthier options? This is A Healthier Michigan Podcast, episode 155. And coming up, we discuss ways we can approach snacking in a smarter way while on the go.
Welcome to A Healthier Michigan Podcast, the podcast dedicated to navigating how we can improve our health and well-being through small, healthy habits we can start implementing right now. I'm your host, Chuck Gaidica, and every other week we sit down with a certified expert and we discuss topics that cover nutrition, fitness, and a lot more. And on this episode, we're going big on snacking, how we can set ourselves up for success when it comes to fueling our bodies while on the go. With me today is registered dietitian for Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan, Shanthi Appelö. Shanthi, nice to see you again.
Shanthi Appelö:
Nice to see you.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, this is interesting because we sort of make assumptions, I think, about snacking. We're constantly, it seems, on the go, all of us, one way or another, whether you got a big family, no family, you're driving here and there. And you're trying to make healthier choices that may fall to the wayside at times because we get too busy or something else comes up, and you're favoring convenience. That's not a new topic, it's just it's the way the world is revolving, I guess, now.
But if we look at some of the data, according to the CDC, 37% of adults are consuming fast food on a given day. And fast food snacking would fall into that. So it appears that fast food snacking and other fast food can impact blood sugar, blood pressure, our overall health, at least in the short term. And additionally, they say that diets rich in fast food could lead to all kinds of issues for the body, maybe digestion, inflammation, heart health, a whole lot more. So how do we approach smart snacking while we're on the go so we can keep our health great and still be fueled up in between these pit stops of life?
Shanthi Appelö:
So I think maybe it's helpful to talk about why we snack as a society and why we should snack. So first, a lot of us snack because we're bored, because we want to indulge in something that tastes really good. Maybe we're distracted, we're just sitting at our desk, we're typing, working, and the food right there next to you is just a distraction. It could be that we're hungry, maybe it's something cultural. Some people snack because they're not sure where their next meal is going to come from. So food insecurity driving it.
Now, why we should snack is more so they are these kind of blanks to fill out our fuel for the next meal. So they give us more energy throughout the day. Oftentimes people eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner, so it's something to hold you over. It can also be something that prevents you from overeating at your meal. So say you eat breakfast at 7:00 AM. You're not going to eat lunch until 1:00 PM. That can make you kind of run out of energy. And maybe once you do get to that 1:00 PM meal, you're overeating, you're eating so fast you're not really recognizing how much you're eating. And so the last thing I think is it's a great way to fit in all the nutrients that you kind of didn't get in to your meals. If you, for example, know what you're going to have, a general idea of what you're going to have throughout the day, you're like, "Huh, I'm not really getting my goal for vegetables or protein or something." It's a way to fit that in.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, it's interesting because I think, I'll just speak for me, sometimes I think, "Well, I'm not thinking of protein or vegetables all the time." I'm thinking, "Oh, this candy bar has nuts, so it must be okay, right? I'm doing something good for myself," and obviously I'm talking myself into that one. But trying to find a way to get healthy snacks even for purchase is going to be a challenge unless you're one of these folks that use all kinds of containers and baggies. And I know you've talked about food prep in the past. That's a way to maybe navigate into that space, right?
Shanthi Appelö:
You're so right. It can be challenging to find things at the grocery store or at convenience stores that don't have a ton of added sugar in them or aren't so heavily processed in another way. It's hard to find a granola bar, a protein bar, anything like it that doesn't have a candy's worth of sugar. So it can be challenging. I think, too, it's important to note that our country spends about $14 billion a year on advertising for food, and 80% of those are going to promote the fast food, the sugary drinks, the candy and the snacks that we're talking about that aren't so healthy. So they're very accessible to us, they're easier to grab and go, and unfortunately, they're not formulated for health oftentimes, even if they say that they are. So I do have some of my favorite snacks I could share.
Chuck Gaidica:
Yeah, sure.
Shanthi Appelö:
So some of these might be a little interesting. I grew up in a different country, and so I tend to maybe eat a little bit differently than some people. But I remember first moving to the US and being really shocked that chips were such a regular part of a rotation for snacks. I had only ever been allowed to have that, I moved here as a teenager, but I had only ever had that on special occasions or a Friday night when you're watching a movie, never as a snack.
Chuck Gaidica:
You're talking about potato chips?
Shanthi Appelö:
Potato chips, yeah. Those were special occasion foods. But some of the things that we would see in our school cafeteria that I often would have, still have, are things like kefir. It's rich in probiotics. It's got some protein. Oftentimes there's some fruit blended into it. We would also see a lot of open-faced sandwiches. So this is what I encourage people to do with snacking is think outside the box. Snack foods don't have to just be snack foods, breakfast foods don't just have to be breakfast foods and so on and so forth. So sometimes as a snack, I'll just heat up a very small portion of my leftovers from the night before. It doesn't have to be lunch. I'm just needing something to hold me over until my next meal or to give me some energy.
But the open-faced sandwiches I love because you can make them so versatile. You can have one wholewheat piece of toast or something like that. They range from 70 to a hundred calories where you're packing in a lot of fiber. And then so many opportunities for protein on top. I love putting hummus on them. I am not an egg eater, but sliced egg is a great option too to get some protein. And so many different options for vegetables. Sliced tomato, avocado, so many different things. So you can make it your own. You can make it to what you're feeling that day. But what I like to keep in mind for snacks in general is we want to keep it to about 150 to 250 calories.
Chuck Gaidica:
So does that idea also sneak in that, we've heard of this over time, the five smaller meals a day? In other words, you're calling it a snack, but if I'm going to have an open-faced sandwich at 11 o'clock in the morning to get me toward lunchtime or same thing in the afternoon, that's kind of a mini meal. But that makes sense because I am-
Shanthi Appelö:
That's kind of what a snack is though, right? It's just food.
Chuck Gaidica:
Yeah. Right.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah. And so it's up to us what we want to make that snack in our mind. And again, it comes down to this caloric value. If we want to try to stay under 250 or so, that's where a lot of these snack bars are as well. So think about, I was saying the open-faced sandwich, maybe it's 70 calories for an egg, that's all protein, 70 calories for the slice of bread. Maybe you spread something on it like hummus, 30 calories, and some 30 calories of vegetables. That'll really fill you up with that protein and that fiber. So I think that's important.
Now, dark chocolate with nuts is a good idea. I also love cutting up some Honeycrisp apple slices and serving that with just a tablespoon or two of almond butter. There's so many different fun nut butters out there now. I know people love peanut butter, but in the almond and cashew butter category, they've got all these ones now that they add flax seeds to to add a little bit more fiber. They've got vanilla flavors. They've got all these different things that don't necessarily add a lot of sugar. So I love those with some apple slices.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, to be fair, some convenience stores have caught the wave, and you can walk in and it's a matter of getting your hand to go the right way. Is it going to be the fat-laden meat sticks and chips department, or is it going to be that little cup of hummus with carrot sticks? You can find those. You can find fresh bananas. You can find other things. But you've got to somehow program yourself to figure those out.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yes, yes. And I think it's no secret that the food inflation is real. A lot of people are experiencing sticker shock at the grocery store. So if you're looking for snacks to easily pack that you spend maybe 15 minutes a week putting together so that you're ready to go. I love doing that for work, for example. But cut up some fruit, put all kinds of different fruit in different containers. Maybe you put a little bit of the almond butter, like I was saying, in a little container, a few of those. You may want to do something like pre-portioning your hummus. You talked about the little pre-portioned hummus packets. So crazy how expensive those are compared to if you make them at home. And I think one of the things people tend to do when they don't buy the prepackaged snacks is that they don't necessarily portion it out for themselves. And that's where we can get in trouble and overdo the caloric consumption a little bit, especially when it comes to foods that are very dense in calories.
So I'm talking about nuts here because they are a healthy fat, but fat still has nine calories per gram, so it adds up. So I suggest people think about that. If you're wondering what a serving size is, it's different for every person. It's different for what fills you up. But if you want to shoot for that kind of caloric range I gave you, that's a good option. But the nutrition facts label does have pretty good guidance when it comes to what a serving is.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, that portion control thing, I mean, you're really smart to say that snack is a mini meal because we've got this portion control thing as a society maybe out of control at times anyway. So if that extends to snacking, I'm thinking how many times have we jumped in a car in a state where we say, "What are you doing this weekend?" "Oh, I'm going up north." And how many times have we pulled over to get gas or something, and that bag of nuts isn't the little small one. It's the 5.95 bag of nuts. That's pretty easy to go through on a couple hour drive. So you've got to have some discipline in trying to figure out what are you going to do? You're going to eat a few, and you set them down. To be honest, I take that bag and I Ziploc it back and I throw it in the back seat because I can't get it because-
Shanthi Appelö:
No access.
Chuck Gaidica:
... I know I'm going to keep getting it. Right, yeah.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah. And that's where a lot of that distracted eating and boredom eating comes in, especially when we're driving. So I think if we know we're going to be putting ourselves into situations like that, like for example, sitting at your desk or driving for a long period of time, set yourself up for success.
Chuck Gaidica:
The connection to our health is always intriguing because just like large meals, you're three squares a day if you're going to have them, it's interesting to see how much salt and sugar is packed into various foods. And again, to be fair, I have seen, not many, but if we go back to the nuts analogy, you can find unsalted nuts, but it's not easy because they seem to all have salt. And then now I've noticed what they do, and I don't eat a lot of nuts, but I've paid attention, sea salt, as if that makes it better that there's a lot of sodium in there. I don't know. Is it coming from the Dead Sea or the Atlantic? I'm not sure. It's just they're trying to make it sound a little more healthy for you, right?
Shanthi Appelö:
Yes. But we know, we know it's basically the same thing, and our blood pressure isn't going to pass judgment on whether it's sea salt or table salt or Himalayan sea salt.
Chuck Gaidica:
Right. And then there's this other idea that you're pointing out that oftentimes we're snacking while streaming something, driving, sitting at a desk, whether at work or at home. You've got kind of a double whammy there, don't you, Shanthi, where you're not moving and you're now ingesting maybe a lot of salt. So if you're not hydrating well, now what?
Shanthi Appelö:
I think for occasions like that, it's nice to be able to mindlessly snack sometimes. We're all guilty of it. But some things that I like to do for those situations, if I know I'm going to be in a car for a long time is I'll pack sliced cucumber. I love European cucumber or the English cucumber because they don't have a lot of seeds inside. But dipping that in a little bit of buffalo sauce or some Greek yogurt is so good, and you can kind of keep crunching. Same goes for carrots. I love these carrot chips that you can find at the grocery store. They're just crinkle cut. There's nothing fancy about them. But the way that they're cut, it does something to me. I like them, and my dogs like them too. But anyways, when we find things like that that are these non-starchy vegetables, we can really fill up on them. And I think that's important. I think a reminder too is that the recommendation for fruits and vegetables is three vegetables, two fruits a day. So that's a great opportunity for us to fit those in in our snacking sessions.
Chuck Gaidica:
And you were kind of saying this, but back to portion control, if you're grabbing a handful of crinkle cut carrots, you're not counting them or weighing, you're just grabbing a handful and go, why?
Shanthi Appelö:
You don't have to.
Chuck Gaidica:
Yeah.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah, there's nothing really to mind there.
Chuck Gaidica:
So what other personal things do you like to take with you, because some of these things I can see, I'm not a big kefir guy, I love Greek yogurt, but there are certain things where I'm kind like, "Oh, I cannot see driving up north with a cup holder filled with a cup of kefir."
Shanthi Appelö:
I love that you're imagining this though. You're like-
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, I'm trying to get into the kefir thing because I've tried it and I'm like, "Ah." I'm not quite sure.
Shanthi Appelö:
Understandable.
Chuck Gaidica:
What are the ways to get over that? Is it simply just trying it once because I've got this preconceived notion of what it may be like?
Shanthi Appelö:
No, my fiancé, he won't touch it either because he is scarred from the time that he poured it. Actually, no, he didn't just pour it into his coffee. He steamed it first. We've got a little espresso maker. He pours it in. He notices it's quite thick, but maybe thinks, "Oh, well, it's kind of like heavy whipping cream. We'll steam this up." Oh, my goodness. Could you imagine the sour coffee plus the sour kefir? So yeah, no, it's not widely accepted in my house.
So instead, yeah, Greek yogurt with some cut fruit is great. I love mixing a little bit of this lemon-flavored yogurt with some plain yogurt because I don't love mine very sweet. So I do a little mix of both. I also really love crunchy chickpeas. There's this brand called Biena. They have all kinds of flavors. There's ranch, there's an everything bagel seasoning, there's honey roasted barbecue. There's all kinds of flavors. And what's great about them is that they're roasted. They're not fried. But they are so crunchy, full of fiber. It's crazy how much fiber's in chickpeas, and of course it's going to hold you over until your next meal. And they're really tasty too. You can make them in the air fryer.
Chuck Gaidica:
And do you season them when you make them in the air fryer?
Shanthi Appelö:
I do. Yeah. You can do all kinds of fun things. I do a little bit of brown sugar with cayenne pepper, a little sweet and spicy action. And I think it's good to be cautious of how much sugar is in things, but don't be afraid to use a little bit to make something more palatable. We just want to be cautious of how much. Another thing I love to bring is popcorn. So of course, light popped. We want to stick to those that have about 35 calories per cup, so you can have a few cups if you like. Actually on ahealthiermichigan.org, we have some great fun recipes of some DIY mixes you can do for your popcorn. And one of my favorites is one with nutritional yeast, because nutritional yeast, it's not actually yeast, but it adds this beautiful nuttiness and adds a little bit of extra protein. And it's almost like a sprinkle of cheese on there.
Chuck Gaidica:
Is that what it tastes like? I've never had it on popcorn.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah, kind of. And if you mix it with a little bit of maybe some herbs like dried thyme or dried oregano with a little bit of garlic, it definitely hits the spot.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, it's interesting you're saying 35 calories a cup, because the popcorn that's supposed to keep me skinny, I'm going by memory, if I'm not wrong, it's like a hundred calories per cup. So there still is some fat or something in there beyond the popcorn.
Shanthi Appelö:
And just, again, it goes back to how much you're looking to have in a snack calorically for your size and your goals, and what really is going to hold you over. And then, again, what you're looking for as far as palatability. If you're someone who just wants a little bit of extra fat, maybe you just have less. I think it's silly to just go for the extreme healthy option sometimes when there's plenty of nutrients that we can have that is a little bit more palatable with some fat and some sugar.
Chuck Gaidica:
So being deprived as a youngster as you were where you couldn't have chips or sweet candy unless it were a special day of the week, I'm making stuff up here, I'm joking with you. But the idea of what does Shanthi have when you want to go crazy. Do you grab a candy bar? What do you have? And can you do that with people around you who know what you do for a living? Or are you like, "Oh, I got to hide now"?
Shanthi Appelö:
Well, yeah. So it's funny. In Sweden, there's something called Lördagsgodis, and it means Saturday candy. And it's this phenomenon where basically kids only eat candy on Saturdays. It's wild, but it happens. And maybe on Christmas and things like that, your birthday, maybe you get some candy. But yeah, it's a real thing. But I think it has shaped what I consider snacks. I am proud to say that I am a dietitian who would never pass judgment on anyone, and I'm not going to feel guilty about what I consume in front of people, because people will say stuff. They're like, "Oh, the dietician's here, I'm going to be careful." But I think it's so important to have the foods that you enjoy and just find balance. But if I were to say my guilty pleasures, it would be Nutella by the spoon.
Chuck Gaidica:
That's a good one.
Shanthi Appelö:
And honestly, chips with sour cream. I love these pop chips. They actually are popped. I just love the way they taste. But the barbecue flavor. They are kind of actually lower in calories than a lot of potato chips. But they are popped. They are delightful, the crunch. And with a little bit of sour cream, that's my jam.
Chuck Gaidica:
It is interesting how your childhood can influence even your taste buds moving forward through adulthood. My wife was raised in the South, and her big thing with her family Sunday nights was having chips, just that time, she never mentions chips another time, with sour cream and onion dip. And to this day, if she has a craving, that's what it is. But it takes her immediately back to Sunday nights as a kid, and she'll say it out loud every time.
Shanthi Appelö:
I love that.
Chuck Gaidica:
And that is in a way, for her, maybe it's not tomato soup and grilled cheese, but that's comfort food for her because she's thinking of her mom and dad and all that goes with it. So it's kind of fun. So in your experience, are there any other strategies we should be thinking about when it comes to smarter snacking habits? I mean, you've covered a lot. I mean, busy schedules. I think a large part of this is trying to consider prepping to try to get ahead of the curve?
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah, plan, prep. I think also write things down that you like as a snack, because sometimes when they fall out of your rotation, it's easy to forget about them. So something my fiancé and I do is every Sunday at 10 o'clock, we sit down around the dinner table and we have breakfast together. I know we sleep in quite a bit. But we talk about what we were going to have for the week ahead meal-wise. We also talk about what snacks are going to fit in there, what breakfast we're going to have, and which ones are going to be convenience things, like which days might we not want to cook. And we create a grocery list accordingly so that we don't really go out of that.
But I think it's something that helps us because then we can go back. I write these things down. It's almost like I take minutes. But I will go back and be like, "Huh, what did we used to snack on that was so good?" And it'll bring back some things. So anyways, I encourage people to write things down that they really enjoy, bring them back into rotation and switch it up sometimes. And when it comes down to it, your preferences are going to change. Don't feel guilty about it. But try to fit in some things that are going to be filling in the gaps for your nutrition for the day.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, you've got so much knowledge in this department. I have to tell you that if I had to sit next to you at a dinner party, I would be, this has happened to me in the past, I'd be looking at, if you're looking at what I'm getting, what's my portion? Did I get an extra piece of cake? I had to sit next to the former head of Weight Watchers, the late Florine Mark, on a panel luncheon, and they're done with lunch, and the guy comes up, the server, "Would you like dessert?" and puts this plate of chocolate cake. Shanthi, I couldn't eat it. I mean, I thought, "I would love to have it," but there would be a little pressure there. And so that's an interesting long way of me saying, that conversation you're having with your fiancé, you're kind of applying pressure to each other though, aren't you? That you're planning, that you're talking about it, that you're going to shop from a list. You've got a shopping buddy there. That itself is a bit of accountability.
Shanthi Appelö:
It is nice. And we do make sure that we fit in things that we love and that are special treats. Ice cream is certainly going on there. The hazelnut crunch line.
Chuck Gaidica:
We left that one out. Holy cow. Yeah. Well, any other takeaways before we wrap it up?
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah, just think outside the box. Snack foods do not just have to be snacks. Have that open-faced sandwich. And if people want to learn more, A Healthier Michigan has got a lot of interesting snack options, including that one tip that I included for the popcorn. Those seasonings are really fun.
Chuck Gaidica:
Yeah. Great. Well, good to see you again. Thanks so much.
Shanthi Appelö:
Thanks, Chuck.
Chuck Gaidica:
Shanthi Appelö is a registered dietician for Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan. We thank her and we thank you for listening to A Healthier Michigan Podcast. It is brought to you by Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan. If you liked the show and you want to know more, check us out at the newly refreshed website that Shanthi was talking about, ahealthiermichigan.org/podcast. When you include podcast, you get all of our episodes, over 150 of them now. But you can also get all those other great posts, like the one about popcorn and so much more. You can leave us a review or a rating on Apple Podcast or Spotify. You can check us out on our YouTube channel, and you can also follow us on Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter. You can get new episodes, old episodes for your smartphone or tablet. So be sure to subscribe to us. Hit that button on Apple Podcast or Spotify or your favorite podcast app. I'm Chuck Gaidica. Stay well.
Shanthi Appelö:
Nice to see you.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, this is interesting because we sort of make assumptions, I think, about snacking. We're constantly, it seems, on the go, all of us, one way or another, whether you got a big family, no family, you're driving here and there. And you're trying to make healthier choices that may fall to the wayside at times because we get too busy or something else comes up, and you're favoring convenience. That's not a new topic, it's just it's the way the world is revolving, I guess, now.
But if we look at some of the data, according to the CDC, 37% of adults are consuming fast food on a given day. And fast food snacking would fall into that. So it appears that fast food snacking and other fast food can impact blood sugar, blood pressure, our overall health, at least in the short term. And additionally, they say that diets rich in fast food could lead to all kinds of issues for the body, maybe digestion, inflammation, heart health, a whole lot more. So how do we approach smart snacking while we're on the go so we can keep our health great and still be fueled up in between these pit stops of life?
Shanthi Appelö:
So I think maybe it's helpful to talk about why we snack as a society and why we should snack. So first, a lot of us snack because we're bored, because we want to indulge in something that tastes really good. Maybe we're distracted, we're just sitting at our desk, we're typing, working, and the food right there next to you is just a distraction. It could be that we're hungry, maybe it's something cultural. Some people snack because they're not sure where their next meal is going to come from. So food insecurity driving it.
Now, why we should snack is more so they are these kind of blanks to fill out our fuel for the next meal. So they give us more energy throughout the day. Oftentimes people eat breakfast, lunch, and dinner, so it's something to hold you over. It can also be something that prevents you from overeating at your meal. So say you eat breakfast at 7:00 AM. You're not going to eat lunch until 1:00 PM. That can make you kind of run out of energy. And maybe once you do get to that 1:00 PM meal, you're overeating, you're eating so fast you're not really recognizing how much you're eating. And so the last thing I think is it's a great way to fit in all the nutrients that you kind of didn't get in to your meals. If you, for example, know what you're going to have, a general idea of what you're going to have throughout the day, you're like, "Huh, I'm not really getting my goal for vegetables or protein or something." It's a way to fit that in.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, it's interesting because I think, I'll just speak for me, sometimes I think, "Well, I'm not thinking of protein or vegetables all the time." I'm thinking, "Oh, this candy bar has nuts, so it must be okay, right? I'm doing something good for myself," and obviously I'm talking myself into that one. But trying to find a way to get healthy snacks even for purchase is going to be a challenge unless you're one of these folks that use all kinds of containers and baggies. And I know you've talked about food prep in the past. That's a way to maybe navigate into that space, right?
Shanthi Appelö:
You're so right. It can be challenging to find things at the grocery store or at convenience stores that don't have a ton of added sugar in them or aren't so heavily processed in another way. It's hard to find a granola bar, a protein bar, anything like it that doesn't have a candy's worth of sugar. So it can be challenging. I think, too, it's important to note that our country spends about $14 billion a year on advertising for food, and 80% of those are going to promote the fast food, the sugary drinks, the candy and the snacks that we're talking about that aren't so healthy. So they're very accessible to us, they're easier to grab and go, and unfortunately, they're not formulated for health oftentimes, even if they say that they are. So I do have some of my favorite snacks I could share.
Chuck Gaidica:
Yeah, sure.
Shanthi Appelö:
So some of these might be a little interesting. I grew up in a different country, and so I tend to maybe eat a little bit differently than some people. But I remember first moving to the US and being really shocked that chips were such a regular part of a rotation for snacks. I had only ever been allowed to have that, I moved here as a teenager, but I had only ever had that on special occasions or a Friday night when you're watching a movie, never as a snack.
Chuck Gaidica:
You're talking about potato chips?
Shanthi Appelö:
Potato chips, yeah. Those were special occasion foods. But some of the things that we would see in our school cafeteria that I often would have, still have, are things like kefir. It's rich in probiotics. It's got some protein. Oftentimes there's some fruit blended into it. We would also see a lot of open-faced sandwiches. So this is what I encourage people to do with snacking is think outside the box. Snack foods don't have to just be snack foods, breakfast foods don't just have to be breakfast foods and so on and so forth. So sometimes as a snack, I'll just heat up a very small portion of my leftovers from the night before. It doesn't have to be lunch. I'm just needing something to hold me over until my next meal or to give me some energy.
But the open-faced sandwiches I love because you can make them so versatile. You can have one wholewheat piece of toast or something like that. They range from 70 to a hundred calories where you're packing in a lot of fiber. And then so many opportunities for protein on top. I love putting hummus on them. I am not an egg eater, but sliced egg is a great option too to get some protein. And so many different options for vegetables. Sliced tomato, avocado, so many different things. So you can make it your own. You can make it to what you're feeling that day. But what I like to keep in mind for snacks in general is we want to keep it to about 150 to 250 calories.
Chuck Gaidica:
So does that idea also sneak in that, we've heard of this over time, the five smaller meals a day? In other words, you're calling it a snack, but if I'm going to have an open-faced sandwich at 11 o'clock in the morning to get me toward lunchtime or same thing in the afternoon, that's kind of a mini meal. But that makes sense because I am-
Shanthi Appelö:
That's kind of what a snack is though, right? It's just food.
Chuck Gaidica:
Yeah. Right.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah. And so it's up to us what we want to make that snack in our mind. And again, it comes down to this caloric value. If we want to try to stay under 250 or so, that's where a lot of these snack bars are as well. So think about, I was saying the open-faced sandwich, maybe it's 70 calories for an egg, that's all protein, 70 calories for the slice of bread. Maybe you spread something on it like hummus, 30 calories, and some 30 calories of vegetables. That'll really fill you up with that protein and that fiber. So I think that's important.
Now, dark chocolate with nuts is a good idea. I also love cutting up some Honeycrisp apple slices and serving that with just a tablespoon or two of almond butter. There's so many different fun nut butters out there now. I know people love peanut butter, but in the almond and cashew butter category, they've got all these ones now that they add flax seeds to to add a little bit more fiber. They've got vanilla flavors. They've got all these different things that don't necessarily add a lot of sugar. So I love those with some apple slices.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, to be fair, some convenience stores have caught the wave, and you can walk in and it's a matter of getting your hand to go the right way. Is it going to be the fat-laden meat sticks and chips department, or is it going to be that little cup of hummus with carrot sticks? You can find those. You can find fresh bananas. You can find other things. But you've got to somehow program yourself to figure those out.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yes, yes. And I think it's no secret that the food inflation is real. A lot of people are experiencing sticker shock at the grocery store. So if you're looking for snacks to easily pack that you spend maybe 15 minutes a week putting together so that you're ready to go. I love doing that for work, for example. But cut up some fruit, put all kinds of different fruit in different containers. Maybe you put a little bit of the almond butter, like I was saying, in a little container, a few of those. You may want to do something like pre-portioning your hummus. You talked about the little pre-portioned hummus packets. So crazy how expensive those are compared to if you make them at home. And I think one of the things people tend to do when they don't buy the prepackaged snacks is that they don't necessarily portion it out for themselves. And that's where we can get in trouble and overdo the caloric consumption a little bit, especially when it comes to foods that are very dense in calories.
So I'm talking about nuts here because they are a healthy fat, but fat still has nine calories per gram, so it adds up. So I suggest people think about that. If you're wondering what a serving size is, it's different for every person. It's different for what fills you up. But if you want to shoot for that kind of caloric range I gave you, that's a good option. But the nutrition facts label does have pretty good guidance when it comes to what a serving is.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, that portion control thing, I mean, you're really smart to say that snack is a mini meal because we've got this portion control thing as a society maybe out of control at times anyway. So if that extends to snacking, I'm thinking how many times have we jumped in a car in a state where we say, "What are you doing this weekend?" "Oh, I'm going up north." And how many times have we pulled over to get gas or something, and that bag of nuts isn't the little small one. It's the 5.95 bag of nuts. That's pretty easy to go through on a couple hour drive. So you've got to have some discipline in trying to figure out what are you going to do? You're going to eat a few, and you set them down. To be honest, I take that bag and I Ziploc it back and I throw it in the back seat because I can't get it because-
Shanthi Appelö:
No access.
Chuck Gaidica:
... I know I'm going to keep getting it. Right, yeah.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah. And that's where a lot of that distracted eating and boredom eating comes in, especially when we're driving. So I think if we know we're going to be putting ourselves into situations like that, like for example, sitting at your desk or driving for a long period of time, set yourself up for success.
Chuck Gaidica:
The connection to our health is always intriguing because just like large meals, you're three squares a day if you're going to have them, it's interesting to see how much salt and sugar is packed into various foods. And again, to be fair, I have seen, not many, but if we go back to the nuts analogy, you can find unsalted nuts, but it's not easy because they seem to all have salt. And then now I've noticed what they do, and I don't eat a lot of nuts, but I've paid attention, sea salt, as if that makes it better that there's a lot of sodium in there. I don't know. Is it coming from the Dead Sea or the Atlantic? I'm not sure. It's just they're trying to make it sound a little more healthy for you, right?
Shanthi Appelö:
Yes. But we know, we know it's basically the same thing, and our blood pressure isn't going to pass judgment on whether it's sea salt or table salt or Himalayan sea salt.
Chuck Gaidica:
Right. And then there's this other idea that you're pointing out that oftentimes we're snacking while streaming something, driving, sitting at a desk, whether at work or at home. You've got kind of a double whammy there, don't you, Shanthi, where you're not moving and you're now ingesting maybe a lot of salt. So if you're not hydrating well, now what?
Shanthi Appelö:
I think for occasions like that, it's nice to be able to mindlessly snack sometimes. We're all guilty of it. But some things that I like to do for those situations, if I know I'm going to be in a car for a long time is I'll pack sliced cucumber. I love European cucumber or the English cucumber because they don't have a lot of seeds inside. But dipping that in a little bit of buffalo sauce or some Greek yogurt is so good, and you can kind of keep crunching. Same goes for carrots. I love these carrot chips that you can find at the grocery store. They're just crinkle cut. There's nothing fancy about them. But the way that they're cut, it does something to me. I like them, and my dogs like them too. But anyways, when we find things like that that are these non-starchy vegetables, we can really fill up on them. And I think that's important. I think a reminder too is that the recommendation for fruits and vegetables is three vegetables, two fruits a day. So that's a great opportunity for us to fit those in in our snacking sessions.
Chuck Gaidica:
And you were kind of saying this, but back to portion control, if you're grabbing a handful of crinkle cut carrots, you're not counting them or weighing, you're just grabbing a handful and go, why?
Shanthi Appelö:
You don't have to.
Chuck Gaidica:
Yeah.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah, there's nothing really to mind there.
Chuck Gaidica:
So what other personal things do you like to take with you, because some of these things I can see, I'm not a big kefir guy, I love Greek yogurt, but there are certain things where I'm kind like, "Oh, I cannot see driving up north with a cup holder filled with a cup of kefir."
Shanthi Appelö:
I love that you're imagining this though. You're like-
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, I'm trying to get into the kefir thing because I've tried it and I'm like, "Ah." I'm not quite sure.
Shanthi Appelö:
Understandable.
Chuck Gaidica:
What are the ways to get over that? Is it simply just trying it once because I've got this preconceived notion of what it may be like?
Shanthi Appelö:
No, my fiancé, he won't touch it either because he is scarred from the time that he poured it. Actually, no, he didn't just pour it into his coffee. He steamed it first. We've got a little espresso maker. He pours it in. He notices it's quite thick, but maybe thinks, "Oh, well, it's kind of like heavy whipping cream. We'll steam this up." Oh, my goodness. Could you imagine the sour coffee plus the sour kefir? So yeah, no, it's not widely accepted in my house.
So instead, yeah, Greek yogurt with some cut fruit is great. I love mixing a little bit of this lemon-flavored yogurt with some plain yogurt because I don't love mine very sweet. So I do a little mix of both. I also really love crunchy chickpeas. There's this brand called Biena. They have all kinds of flavors. There's ranch, there's an everything bagel seasoning, there's honey roasted barbecue. There's all kinds of flavors. And what's great about them is that they're roasted. They're not fried. But they are so crunchy, full of fiber. It's crazy how much fiber's in chickpeas, and of course it's going to hold you over until your next meal. And they're really tasty too. You can make them in the air fryer.
Chuck Gaidica:
And do you season them when you make them in the air fryer?
Shanthi Appelö:
I do. Yeah. You can do all kinds of fun things. I do a little bit of brown sugar with cayenne pepper, a little sweet and spicy action. And I think it's good to be cautious of how much sugar is in things, but don't be afraid to use a little bit to make something more palatable. We just want to be cautious of how much. Another thing I love to bring is popcorn. So of course, light popped. We want to stick to those that have about 35 calories per cup, so you can have a few cups if you like. Actually on ahealthiermichigan.org, we have some great fun recipes of some DIY mixes you can do for your popcorn. And one of my favorites is one with nutritional yeast, because nutritional yeast, it's not actually yeast, but it adds this beautiful nuttiness and adds a little bit of extra protein. And it's almost like a sprinkle of cheese on there.
Chuck Gaidica:
Is that what it tastes like? I've never had it on popcorn.
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah, kind of. And if you mix it with a little bit of maybe some herbs like dried thyme or dried oregano with a little bit of garlic, it definitely hits the spot.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, it's interesting you're saying 35 calories a cup, because the popcorn that's supposed to keep me skinny, I'm going by memory, if I'm not wrong, it's like a hundred calories per cup. So there still is some fat or something in there beyond the popcorn.
Shanthi Appelö:
And just, again, it goes back to how much you're looking to have in a snack calorically for your size and your goals, and what really is going to hold you over. And then, again, what you're looking for as far as palatability. If you're someone who just wants a little bit of extra fat, maybe you just have less. I think it's silly to just go for the extreme healthy option sometimes when there's plenty of nutrients that we can have that is a little bit more palatable with some fat and some sugar.
Chuck Gaidica:
So being deprived as a youngster as you were where you couldn't have chips or sweet candy unless it were a special day of the week, I'm making stuff up here, I'm joking with you. But the idea of what does Shanthi have when you want to go crazy. Do you grab a candy bar? What do you have? And can you do that with people around you who know what you do for a living? Or are you like, "Oh, I got to hide now"?
Shanthi Appelö:
Well, yeah. So it's funny. In Sweden, there's something called Lördagsgodis, and it means Saturday candy. And it's this phenomenon where basically kids only eat candy on Saturdays. It's wild, but it happens. And maybe on Christmas and things like that, your birthday, maybe you get some candy. But yeah, it's a real thing. But I think it has shaped what I consider snacks. I am proud to say that I am a dietitian who would never pass judgment on anyone, and I'm not going to feel guilty about what I consume in front of people, because people will say stuff. They're like, "Oh, the dietician's here, I'm going to be careful." But I think it's so important to have the foods that you enjoy and just find balance. But if I were to say my guilty pleasures, it would be Nutella by the spoon.
Chuck Gaidica:
That's a good one.
Shanthi Appelö:
And honestly, chips with sour cream. I love these pop chips. They actually are popped. I just love the way they taste. But the barbecue flavor. They are kind of actually lower in calories than a lot of potato chips. But they are popped. They are delightful, the crunch. And with a little bit of sour cream, that's my jam.
Chuck Gaidica:
It is interesting how your childhood can influence even your taste buds moving forward through adulthood. My wife was raised in the South, and her big thing with her family Sunday nights was having chips, just that time, she never mentions chips another time, with sour cream and onion dip. And to this day, if she has a craving, that's what it is. But it takes her immediately back to Sunday nights as a kid, and she'll say it out loud every time.
Shanthi Appelö:
I love that.
Chuck Gaidica:
And that is in a way, for her, maybe it's not tomato soup and grilled cheese, but that's comfort food for her because she's thinking of her mom and dad and all that goes with it. So it's kind of fun. So in your experience, are there any other strategies we should be thinking about when it comes to smarter snacking habits? I mean, you've covered a lot. I mean, busy schedules. I think a large part of this is trying to consider prepping to try to get ahead of the curve?
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah, plan, prep. I think also write things down that you like as a snack, because sometimes when they fall out of your rotation, it's easy to forget about them. So something my fiancé and I do is every Sunday at 10 o'clock, we sit down around the dinner table and we have breakfast together. I know we sleep in quite a bit. But we talk about what we were going to have for the week ahead meal-wise. We also talk about what snacks are going to fit in there, what breakfast we're going to have, and which ones are going to be convenience things, like which days might we not want to cook. And we create a grocery list accordingly so that we don't really go out of that.
But I think it's something that helps us because then we can go back. I write these things down. It's almost like I take minutes. But I will go back and be like, "Huh, what did we used to snack on that was so good?" And it'll bring back some things. So anyways, I encourage people to write things down that they really enjoy, bring them back into rotation and switch it up sometimes. And when it comes down to it, your preferences are going to change. Don't feel guilty about it. But try to fit in some things that are going to be filling in the gaps for your nutrition for the day.
Chuck Gaidica:
Well, you've got so much knowledge in this department. I have to tell you that if I had to sit next to you at a dinner party, I would be, this has happened to me in the past, I'd be looking at, if you're looking at what I'm getting, what's my portion? Did I get an extra piece of cake? I had to sit next to the former head of Weight Watchers, the late Florine Mark, on a panel luncheon, and they're done with lunch, and the guy comes up, the server, "Would you like dessert?" and puts this plate of chocolate cake. Shanthi, I couldn't eat it. I mean, I thought, "I would love to have it," but there would be a little pressure there. And so that's an interesting long way of me saying, that conversation you're having with your fiancé, you're kind of applying pressure to each other though, aren't you? That you're planning, that you're talking about it, that you're going to shop from a list. You've got a shopping buddy there. That itself is a bit of accountability.
Shanthi Appelö:
It is nice. And we do make sure that we fit in things that we love and that are special treats. Ice cream is certainly going on there. The hazelnut crunch line.
Chuck Gaidica:
We left that one out. Holy cow. Yeah. Well, any other takeaways before we wrap it up?
Shanthi Appelö:
Yeah, just think outside the box. Snack foods do not just have to be snacks. Have that open-faced sandwich. And if people want to learn more, A Healthier Michigan has got a lot of interesting snack options, including that one tip that I included for the popcorn. Those seasonings are really fun.
Chuck Gaidica:
Yeah. Great. Well, good to see you again. Thanks so much.
Shanthi Appelö:
Thanks, Chuck.
Chuck Gaidica:
Shanthi Appelö is a registered dietician for Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan. We thank her and we thank you for listening to A Healthier Michigan Podcast. It is brought to you by Blue Cross Blue Shield of Michigan. If you liked the show and you want to know more, check us out at the newly refreshed website that Shanthi was talking about, ahealthiermichigan.org/podcast. When you include podcast, you get all of our episodes, over 150 of them now. But you can also get all those other great posts, like the one about popcorn and so much more. You can leave us a review or a rating on Apple Podcast or Spotify. You can check us out on our YouTube channel, and you can also follow us on Facebook, Instagram, or Twitter. You can get new episodes, old episodes for your smartphone or tablet. So be sure to subscribe to us. Hit that button on Apple Podcast or Spotify or your favorite podcast app. I'm Chuck Gaidica. Stay well.
